druid.
The TelenatorThe big and official announcement was made yesterday by Microsoft. Previous to that they sent out notices that the announcement was going to be so earth-shaking that it was ‘not to be missed’. Don’t know if I’d go quite that far, but the announcement did contain a surprise or two for the general public.
Microsoft will be releasing TWO PAD versions, thus confirming all the rumours circulating before. They will release one with NVidia’s ARM processor and then the full-power version — with an Intel I believe and running a full edition of Win8 and able to carry any extra goodies.
The other big surprise is that they have thrown economy to the wind and have gone for upper tier buyers, because the lowest starting price on any MS pad is to be about $700US, according to the announcements. Last I checked, you could get a bare-bones starter iPad for about $400US.
More bad news? Yes, to run your App on both units, if you are a dev, you will have to completely recompile for the ARM version, to be called Windows RT (or vice versa). So we have twice the work for much less than half the bang of anything built for iOS.
Analysis: No mention from MS what the full-duty, full OS pad will cost, but if the seriously limited version will start at $700, I’ll let all of you do the math. No mention about such important issues as audio latency, but do note that NVidia has been the major offender regarding IRC and DPC kernel driver latency issues since the very beginning. Completely unlike Apple, its no secret that Microsoft has been no friend to musicians, recording and other audio people since the beginning as well. One glaring example (and ridiculous to boot) is how MS intentionally hides the ‘Stereo Mix’ or whatever your particular PC maker calls it, a feature that has come with most PCs for years, yet one that few regular users have any idea is there under System Sound or Sound. (It’s actually kept invisible until you click around in the blank area below Microphone.) This Stereo Mix captures any streaming audio that you can hear on your computer, in case you were unaware — a very helpful tool with many uses, if only the user can find it and get it set up!
One final message from Microsoft greatly concerned me during all of this: They have announced that they are so dead-set on having this double-pad launch be a success that they are taking no prisoners — meaning that if any vendors working along with them on this have any problems, MS is prepared to cut them loose and go it all by themselves if they so decide. This continues MS’s behavior of very little thanks or credit for third-party devs and firms who have helped MS along the way to get to its lofty god-like status. One of Microsoft’s major frustrations and dislikes currently is that it cannot control PC builders (read: pad builders now) such as ASUS, that have the power to decide for themselves what they will or will not build into said PCs and now pads.
druidMicrosoft’s concerns sound pretty valid to me. They’ve no doubt taken notice that Apple, who absolutely refuse to let anyone but themselves have control of everything of theirs, including their tenuous IP (declaring “thermonuclear war” on Android, for instance), still manage to be the highest profit company in the world, I believe. How do Apple do that? How are their products seen in such a positive light? Because they control them and keep the build standards pretty high.
So far, Microsoft has had to rely on hardware providers for the most part doing it for them. And that has seen a lot of cost cutting, including cutting corners, and competition from competitors who have been getting little profit on their sales. IT means build quality suffers.
If Microsoft want to change it, they have to start moving to do it themselves.
On that note, however, your comments about their pads almost sound as if there won’t be any cheaper alternatives. Sure, to run the full x86 Windows, you need hardware to support it, which has more abilities and costs more. If more people buy it, and more competition occurs, it will inevitably reduce in price. I’m sure, however, there will be iPad alternatives out there running Windows RT. I personally am not interested in it as I will have to leave a lot of applications I’m used to behind, and I’m willing to pay a premium for it.
In short, I’m not really sure where your problem with it lies. Microsoft won’t be the only ones releaseing tablets, and their build quality seems exceptional in this case, so it will cost a premium…. So my advice is to buy a different manufacturer’s product? And if you don’t want limitations on normal Windows software, avoid Windows RT .. and be prepared to pay a little more for hardware that has a little more capability, as required by the software that it enables to run?
The TelenatorI think anyone who previously planned to wait it out and buy a Microsoft pad computer would have a number of problems, particularly after this week’s announcement — both in what was said and what was left unsaid. The Android products have miserable latency, therefore rendering them totally unfit for any serious audio use whatsoever. From Microsoft on this issue we have . . . complete silence.
Probably the biggest problem is now cost, combined with the realisation that the lower-powered RT pad, said to be starting priced bare-bones at $700 will be wholly inadequate for any sort of DAW use or any other heavy computing work. It is sounding more and more like it will mainly be a ‘check your mail and social networks, stream a movie and let your children use it for lighter children’s software’. Regarding the full-duty pad, I think anyone planning to purchase one would have a problem, not knowing what they can expect to pay for it. Those who have brand loyalty as well, as I do with the outstanding ASUS designs, will now be uncertain whether ASUS will be making many for Microsoft, after this news.
Another real concern is for the Apps to be offered. With two very different Microsoft pads, will the designer of your favourite Apps build them for both pads or only one — and which one will that be? Additionally, some outfits may choose now to avoid Microsoft totally and not offer anything for Windows on a pad, considering that Microsoft has become increasingly demanding and further cannot promise any guaranteed market share. Would you rather place your App on a pad that is much more affordable and that many people will use, or will you offer it to a very restricted smaller market of the few who can afford the pricey premium pads?
These are all problems for the prospective consumer indeed, as well as for the designer of potential Apps, and other concerns for anyone contracted to provide any actual hardware. And there are other concerns. All of the above should be considered in light of Apple’s incredible strength in this niche. The Microsoft pads may actually end up causing sales of iPads to increase, once the iPad has a major contender and price points for comparison. And let’s not forget that Microsoft has had its several blunders in the not too far off past and the present — a bum OS version or two, the relative failure of Bing, the complete failure of Live Essentials, SkyDrive (its shot at cloud storage), and Live Messenger, which has been completely eclipsed by Facebook’s chat. Considering this collection of blunders, it would be extremely unwise NOT to have serious concerns when looking at Microsoft’s track record. I suggest that the only reason Microsoft still exists at all is because it has a complete monopoly in its OS.
I have recently determined, as have most of my friends, colleagues and the vast majority of forum members throughout the Net whose comments I have read, that I will not be purchasing any brand of pad computer, as I am simply without the need for one. As I’ve said before, I believe the PAD is a solution seeking a problem. It is no more portable than today’s laptops — especially once all the cables, wires and needed external devices are connected, as in working with a DAW — and will never be able to match the storage, battery time, heat dispersion and processing power because of its physical limitations, namely the size of its case. The iPad has also been used as a control surface for audio and it does work; however, it has proven a poor second to units dedicated to this duty.
druid: “In short, I’m not really sure where your problem with it lies.” Instead, you can say that I really have no problem at all with Microsoft as it affects me personally, as I wouldn’t touch a pad PC with a 10-foot pole in the current state of things. Although I believe the pad is here to stay, much of the interest is the pure novelty, and much like any new toy, the excitement is gone before long.
If I have any problems and concerns with anything at all in computers, it is that I fear someone like our Frits will devote entirely too much time with developing Podium for an MS pad, thus stretching himself too thin, and we who own Podium on a regular PC or lap top end up paying for this neglect — fewer, smaller upgrades to Podium in what has already attained a snail’s pace. As I read in a very active thread about the iPad at Reaper, one fellow summed it up best: “I own two iPads already but please God, NO! I don’t want Reaper on iPad. I don’t want to see all your energies spent on that when there is so much more left to fix on Reaper as it is now!” I couldn’t agree more with his statement, and I understand his fears. These pads are becoming a nuisance to the advancement of much more practical ways of using PCs and software.
4micaIpad, Mypad, maxipad. They’re all toys(maybe not that last one), and they’ll never compare to a desktop or laptop when it comes to sheer computing power, no matter how micro the tech gets. Touch screens drive me apeshit, as a person’s fat fingers cant compare to the accuracy of a mouse and keyboard. For 700 I could get a bad-ass desktop. What can I say, I couldn’t care less about portability. But thats me.
Still, it would be nice to have Animoog on PC…Arturia’s break with Moog makes me think there will be Moog software in the future.
As long as the pad people stayed over here, and the PC people stayed over here, fine, but the pads and tablets and such are affecting future PC tech. As long as a desktop/laptop is for sale, cool. Hope Win 8 works well with the “alternative” desktop look/control…the touchscreen side of it looks terrible, and after working all day I dont feel like moving my hands and fingers anymore than I have to. Doesn’t get much better than the mouse, I say. Minimal movement with maximum coverage.
Enough old man ramblings, I’ll crawl back in my hole now!
The TelenatorThe TOUCH screen thing: First time I’ve seen this issue brought up anywhere, 4mica!
I hate them with a vengeance, too! You see, I have rather — no, extremely — oily skin. This works wonders for getting around on a guitar neck. I always laughed at those spray cans such as Fast Fret and related products to do the very same thing for $5 to $10 dollars.
But when I’ve been handling my guitar and then switching to my laptop (the norm always), I can’t have any touch screen stuff going on. I tried it on another’s setup — VERY BAD. From an angle, the dried sludge later was grossly apparent. Never again. I have a great mouse I can use, but I’ve got really good at the laptop’s touch pad, and it’s much much faster and much less effort. Very accurate too. I rarely even use keyboard shortcuts, because I can get to it via touchpad usually faster. Cleans up with one quick wipe, too.
As regards the Maxis, . . . well, I do recall as a little lad getting into a box of those and some tampons out of great curiosity. Later, when Mum walks in to find me soaking in the tub, there were a couple of each floating alongside my navy ships as the enemy in epic battle. The look on her face was priceless. Toys indeed!
I have a growing concern over the whole PAD issue. I’ve done battle so far with two who clearly revealed themselves as being of this insane Cult of Apple, who would just as soon everything was on their iPads and the laptop (unless a Mac Pro, of course) be damned. Can’t talk any sense to them, and they got rather nasty and name-calling.
But the larger issue concerns me much more: If the faddishness of this pad phenomena does not pass quickly, we will indeed see, more and more, our favourite devs and companies doing exclusive and time-wasting work — to the neglect of software development for real PCs. I pray for the day that pad sales flatten and begin to reduce, as more people discover how useless they are for many tasks, and how there is no advantage to portability when compared to a modern laptop.
Pulse@The Telenator wrote:
…devs and companies doing exclusive and time-wasting work — to the neglect of software development for real PCs. I pray for the day that pad sales flatten and begin to reduce, as more people discover how useless they are for many tasks, and how there is no advantage to portability when compared to a modern laptop.
That!!!
+1000
druidAh I see where your problem lies now. I can relate, as I used to feel that way about PC gaming moving to consoles. And now look! PCs seem to mostly get ports, a fair portion of which seem to be mediocre at best (in terms of performance). Consoles more often get exclusives than not, get released on first, and have the larger part of social interaction in games (though I don’t miss that part haha).
It’s a tenuous comparison, to be sure, but it was a move that I saw to be impractical, for the worse of gaming as a whole, and didn’t make a lot of sense.
The problem with my comparison, of course, is that consoles are essentially gaming machines, which makes sense for game developers. Here you are concerned about effort by music software developers producing for hardware that isn’t designed for music.
I’m not sure I agree entirely, but I can certainly see your issue. I hated touch when it first came out, but now I think it has a place. I don’t think it’s perfect yet, far from it. And I see voice control becoming bigger later as well. These interfaces I think will grow, whether people like it or not. But only time will tell, and I’m happy to wait on the sidelines for now and see how it plays out.
I can respect Frits for considering new interfaces and how Podium can relate to it. It is forward-thinking. Naturally some will agree, and some will disagree, as with anything. In the near future, I could never see a tablet becoming a main DAW. You’re right about the cables. Do you ever take your guitar out when you go out just to use on the odd occasion in case the mood takes you, though? I’ve known people who do just this. Currently, and in the near future, tablets are good for this. You don’t need all the fancy equipment to just get something down for the relaxation or enjoyment of it. The world is turning to more of a consume when you can model, and tablets fit into that in my view. I can see music production being involved in the same way too.
Whether or not I like where the world is going (which I don’t) I can’t really change it. But there are my general views on it for your consumption. 😉