Topic: Preview 2.27: Adjust timing

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 75 total)
  • #2155
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    2.27 is a short detour from the ongoing series of track-related releases. It introduces more advanced quantize options. No beta yet, but I’d like your input on whether I’ve missed anything obvious:

    The dialog is opened with an “Adjust Timing…” command in the edit menu, next to the existing “Quantize Start” etc. commands.

    I had a look at the documentation for some of the other major hosts, and they all seem to support an “undo quantize” type of command. That means that all events are stored with both the original recorded time, and the last quantized time. That feature will make this release take a bit longer than I anticipated when I started, but I can see the benefit of always having the option to go back to the recorded timing, if you later on regret changes you’ve made with the adjust timing dialog. Anyone have an opinion on this?

    #17580
    michi_mak
    Participant

    Frits, you certainly do listen !!
    this window looks very promising – maybe it lacks an entry for adjusting velocities?
    any plans on providing ‘direct access’ shortcuts ( like adjusting swing amount once and then only performing swing without bringing up this window everytime? )?
    i’d vote for keeping originally recorded timing at hand.

    #17581
    thcilnnahoj
    Participant

    Though I must admit I have little use for it personally (I could do with input quantization, but that’s most likely a completely different matter :P), it’s great to see this “oldie” finally join the party!

    I agree that this type of editing should be non-destructive unless the user wishes it. What would also be nice is a simple preview of where the notes will fall on the grid when applying swing, either in that dialog (as seen in Cubase, I think) or directly in the note editor.
    Ah, the preview checkbox probably already does exactly that…

    #17583
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    @michi_mak wrote:

    this window looks very promising – maybe it lacks an entry for adjusting velocities?

    I considered a single big dialog with controls for adjusting all note event properties, like velocity and transpostion. There would then be similar dialogs for sound events and automation point events, with controls for adjusting fade curve etc. I felt the dialogs became too big, so I decided to split out all timing related adjustments into this dialog. In a later release I’ll add the adjust dialogs for the other event properties, including velocity.

    any plans on providing ‘direct access’ shortcuts ( like adjusting swing amount once and then only performing swing without bringing up this window everytime? )?

    I’ve thought about it, but it may come in a later release. After I implement the other adjust dialogs, I plan to make a preset system for the adjustments. You’ll be able to create presets named “Swing 5%”, “Quantize 1/8 20%”, “Set 10 ms fade-in”, etc. and be able to apply them through key shortcuts.

    #17586
    michi_mak
    Participant

    @Zynewave wrote:

    … You’ll be able to create presets named “Swing 5%”, “Quantize 1/8 20%”, “Set 10 ms fade-in”, etc. and be able to apply them through key shortcuts…

    i instantly fell in love with this idea!!

    #17587
    LiquidProj3ct
    Participant

    @thcilnnahoj wrote:

    I agree that this type of editing should be non-destructive unless the user wishes it.

    I totally agree, even for future midi tools you could implement (as an arpeggiator, etc). Have the option to do it in realtime or destructively it’s a marvelous feature.

    Two aditional points here:

    1. Relative snap, if I quantize notes destructively maybe I want to move them later without lose the groove. I like the way Reaper implements this, you move horizontally a note in its piano roll and it have two snap point: to grid and +/- snap value. You move the note vertically and it remains in its original time.

    2. Custom grids, as FL Studio. You can load any midi file in quantizer tool and it will work as a grid (and velocities). Take a look to its help file: http://flstudio.image-line.com/help/html/pianoroll_qnt.htm

    Best regards

    #17588
    kyran
    Participant

    @LiquidProj3ct wrote:

    @thcilnnahoj wrote:

    2. Custom grids, as FL Studio. You can load any midi file in quantizer tool and it will work as a grid (and velocities). Take a look to its help file: http://flstudio.image-line.com/help/html/pianoroll_qnt.htm

    I like that FL feature a lot. Interface wise you could replace the first editor box (where you select the grid snap) with a selector for the midi file containing the snap grid.

    #17589
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    @kyran wrote:

    @LiquidProj3ct wrote:

    2. Custom grids, as FL Studio. You can load any midi file in quantizer tool and it will work as a grid (and velocities). Take a look to its help file: http://flstudio.image-line.com/help/html/pianoroll_qnt.htm

    I like that FL feature a lot. Interface wise you could replace the first editor box (where you select the grid snap) with a selector for the midi file containing the snap grid.

    What I had in mind was to add an “Extract groove from clipboard events” option, either as a new checkbox option or as an entry in the grid combobox. This is simpler, and also a bit more flexible. You could for example: Beat slice a drumloop sound on a track, press Ctrl+C to copy the events, undo the beat slice command, open the piano-roll, select the note events, select “Adjust timing” and use the “extract groove…” option to apply the timing of the drumloop to the MIDI events.

    #17590
    LiquidProj3ct
    Participant

    I’d say that a MIDI file is more flexible, because you can save it (for a future use), exchange it with other users, edit it easily (timming and velocities!), and you can extract a groove using any third party vst slicer or audio editor

    #17591
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    @LiquidProj3ct wrote:

    I’d say that a MIDI file is more flexible, because you can save it (for a future use), exchange it with other users, edit it easily (timming and velocities!), and you can extract a groove using any third party vst slicer or audio editor

    You can also do that with the solution I suggested. To create a groove file, just export the note sequence to a MIDI file. To apply a groove, drag the MIDI file onto a track, copy the note events to the clipboard, delete the sequence event again, and use the adjust timing dialog. I could remove a couple of those steps, by adding a “Copy events to clipboard” command when you right-click a MIDI file in the browser.

    #17592
    LiquidProj3ct
    Participant

    okay 🙂

    #17595
    kyran
    Participant

    Sounds great 🙂

    #17603
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    Beta1 is up. Everything is implemented, except the backup storage of original timing and the “extract groove…” option. So all changes are applied destructively. The “perform adjustments on original timing” checkbox has no effect yet.

    Please try out the different settings in the dialog, and let me know if it all makes sense.

    #17604
    LiquidProj3ct
    Participant

    Frits, I don’t understand the most of the controls, but it seems that only quantize notes towards the left, I’m a little confused

    #17605
    Zynewave
    Keymaster

    @LiquidProj3ct wrote:

    Frits, I don’t understand the most of the controls, but it seems that only quantize notes towards the left, I’m a little confused

    Please be more specific about what you find confusing. From the above quote I don’t know whether I should throw away the whole dialog and start over.

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